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[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Just Basics wrote:

TheReelStory wrote:

Just Basics wrote:

@argyl53 and @thereelstory

listen mateys I know you both are very passionate about this subject. And I know you both have a fuck load of knowledge on how slots are programmed.

But ffs cmon lads. Have a single ounce of what if’s or maybe’s for for fucks sake!

I myself have retracted a lot of my so called conspiracy’s. Due to having no solid proof or evidence.

My argument is that when there’s a fuck load of money involved. Usually there’s some kind of cover up or manipulation going on behind the scenes.

Neither of you are millionaires, or have any insight whatsoever into the workings on top of the casino pyramids. So just give a little. Instead of giving hard NO’s and Catagorical “Your Completely wrongs”.

Cos to be honest lads, you have no real evidence or proof on how slots give or take once they are out of your hands. It’s the fellas High as fuck above your pay grade that have the answers we want to know. And we are never EVER gonna find out how this shit works. Unless a million dollar company with zero tolerance and who can’t be bought look into the workings of online slots.

So shall we give this subject a break or what? ?

The people above our pay grade have no idea how it works haha. You think any exec in a company knows any detail? Only those who built startups.

Now don’t get me wrong, there is all sorts of hooky shit that goes on. I could tell you some stories (and I will if there is a private way to do so) however, it really has nothing to do with the slots or the Casino operations at a game level.

I.E, a game might get on to a certain Casino because someone took the casino manager out and took him to a strip club and got him a BJ. But the game itself? It’s perfectly legit.

The reality is, Casino’s don’t need to rig games etc. They make money (loads of it) legally. No reason to risk that. The technology is legit and does what it does The other stuff around it? Commercials, business deals, backhanders for preferential positioning on a casino page. THAT’s where the corruption is. You’re right, but you’re looking in the wrong place There is much more money to be made dodging tax and doing hooky (but legal) business deals than illegally rigging slots

So the What your saying here is…yeah the heads of these companies are corrupt as fuck, and don’t give a shit about breaking the law. But no way would they rig slots. Why would they? They don’t need to. It’s not in their interest to.

Fuck me……really?

You are so blind sided by your own faith.

 

 

When did I say they break the law? Of course they don’t. They use all of the legal loopholes that money allows. Doesn’t make it any less hooky or morally deficient. Corporations have, for all of time, done whatever they can within the law to maximise their profits.

Taking someone out for a good time for a preferential decision on your product isn’t illegal. It’s business. It’s not a brown bag full of cash. Buying someone a prostitute isn’t the same as a bribe. It’s still shady as hell though.

And i’m not blinded by faith. I’m knowledgeable because of experience. I’ve been there. I KNOW how it works. I know that it’s all legit and well regulated and that the people who work for Casino’s and slot providers, on the ground level, are all really good smart guys and girls.

If it was really rigged, why the heck would I gamble? I know it’s not in my favour mathematically, but I know it’s legit and fun so that’s why I do it.

Rigging slots would be such a hard and risky thing for a company to do. What i’m telling you is there are far easier and legal ways for them to be shady and make much more money. The one who is blinded by their faith is you. You are SO convinced that this must be true, that you reject all logic that points to the opposite, when in fact if you really looked at it, you’d know that all sorts of shady shit goes on in business (not just gambling. ALL business), just not the bit you’re fixated on 🙂

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Just Basics wrote:

@argyl53 and @thereelstory

listen mateys I know you both are very passionate about this subject. And I know you both have a fuck load of knowledge on how slots are programmed.

But ffs cmon lads. Have a single ounce of what if’s or maybe’s for for fucks sake!

I myself have retracted a lot of my so called conspiracy’s. Due to having no solid proof or evidence.

My argument is that when there’s a fuck load of money involved. Usually there’s some kind of cover up or manipulation going on behind the scenes.

Neither of you are millionaires, or have any insight whatsoever into the workings on top of the casino pyramids. So just give a little. Instead of giving hard NO’s and Catagorical “Your Completely wrongs”.

Cos to be honest lads, you have no real evidence or proof on how slots give or take once they are out of your hands. It’s the fellas High as fuck above your pay grade that have the answers we want to know. And we are never EVER gonna find out how this shit works. Unless a million dollar company with zero tolerance and who can’t be bought look into the workings of online slots.

So shall we give this subject a break or what? ?

The people above our pay grade have no idea how it works haha. You think any exec in a company knows any detail? Only those who built startups.

Now don’t get me wrong, there is all sorts of hooky shit that goes on. I could tell you some stories (and I will if there is a private way to do so) however, it really has nothing to do with the slots or the Casino operations at a game level.

I.E, a game might get on to a certain Casino because someone took the casino manager out and took him to a strip club and got him a BJ. But the game itself? It’s perfectly legit.

The reality is, Casino’s don’t need to rig games etc. They make money (loads of it) legally. No reason to risk that. The technology is legit and does what it does The other stuff around it? Commercials, business deals, backhanders for preferential positioning on a casino page. THAT’s where the corruption is. You’re right, but you’re looking in the wrong place 🙂 There is much more money to be made dodging tax and doing hooky (but legal) business deals than illegally rigging slots 🙂

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

By the way, the lack of true randomness is not there for the player, it’s there as a safeguard to the casino, so a slot doesn’t end up with a negative RTP of 5000%. On certain casinos you can see how novomatic slots have behaved, and you will never see them in a huge deficit.

I’ve already explained how randomness has nothing to do with this. The casino’s protect themselves by using Max Win Caps and Max Stake limits. Beyond this, the mathematical model of the slot itself ensures profitability.

So please explain to me exactly HOW the ‘lack of randomness’ is used to safeguard the Casino? What control does it give them? exactly how is it implemented in order to do this? Explain the exact mechanic to me.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

Cus slots can’t be manipulated: <iframe src=”https://www.youtube.com/embed/DgbufJ_yYI0?feature=oembed&#8221; width=”640″ height=”480″ frameborder=”0″ allowfullscreen=””></iframe>
That’s why casinos have to contact the provider to verify huge wins, cus the slots can’t be manipulated. Right?

I’m confused what your video is supposed to be showing?

But no, when in real play on a live site, slots cannot be manipulated. Big wins are sometimes sent for verification because, believe it or not, slot providers do make mistakes, and you will note in all the T&C’s and help files it will say ‘Technical Malfunction voids all pays’. Casino’s like to check there was not a technical malfunction before paying out big wins.

Bugs in software are a fact of life. They are rare and they are not manipulation. They are mistakes (often in the players favour) that need to be corrected.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Just Basics wrote:

I’m sorry but who gives a shit about which company’s system the slots run on. Wether it be the casinos or the actual slot providers. There’s obviously money deals involved, no matter what bloody server it’s on.

So your saying the casinos have no say whatsoever on how the games run. They just buy the game. And have absolutely nothing invested? No deals on losses no deals on winnings….nada?

And the Game providers have nothing invested. No deals and no vested interest on losses? They just rent the game for one number and that’s it?

like renting a house?

 

I ran the business unit that provided the games, and the people, and only those people, within that business unit had any access to deploy or configure games (and yes, I know this because those people were the ones who set up the servers, deployed and wrote the code, tested integrated games and managed them day in day out).

Of course there are commercial deals. Casino’s keep the majority of profits. Gaming platform providers take a portion and slot providers take a portion (sometimes Gaming Platform and Slot Provider are the same company). Sometimes losses are deducted, sometimes losses carried over. All depends on the commercial arrangement. How does that impact the technicalities of a game?

As for the board? Company boards have bigger things to worry about. They have no clue what goes on in day to day operation. We reported P&L numbers to them. If they werte good they were happy, if not they were grumpy and asked what we were doing about it. That’s about it. They don’t have time to be micromanaging the people on the ground who actually do the work.

Casino’s have pretty much no say. Depends on teh game platform, they can define some limits. On the platform I ran (note ran, I don’t anymore) they could set Max Win cap, Max Stake, Stake selections, Min Stake in order to limit their exposure. Also if the game has multiple RTP versions created (up to the slot provider whether they want to make multiple RTP versions) they can order their prefered RTP. They can also request a specific RTP, but Slot Providers would rarely agree (expensive to redesign) unless it was a really big Casino and worth the hassle. Again, any changes are versioned, tested, independently tested, accredited, hashsummed and verified.

Most things going wrong were in a players favour. A jackpot was once misconfigured so its probability of paying out was higher than it should be, so someone won a chunk of cash when they shouldn’t have done. The things Casino’s worried about was when a game was paying out too much and they were worried it was broken. Other than that, they really didn’t care about anything on a game to game basis after they had ordered it and it was deployed, configured and tested.

Once a slot is live, it makes money. That is all Casino’s care about.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Just Basics wrote:

Head totally blagged ?

But…..

I kind of understand both sides to this random debate.

One side is saying man made tech being truly random simply cannot happen. This I have agreed with many times. And is a 100% fact. Every part of the Rng and other A.I can be manipulated.

And the other side is saying yeah but…..here’s a bunch of stuff to maybe prove your 100% fact maybe wrong.

its just like the fucking rigged debate all over again.

The only real truth here, is non of you really know how these slots work once they are out of your hands. Yeah you know the maths and percentages on how it has been designed. But once it’s left the shop any program can be manipulated to high fucking heaven.

 

 

Just Basics wrote:

No one will EVER know how the percentages and odds work on online slots…..Once they are on the casino slots list. Simple.

Well… no. What we’re saying is that the RNG’s that are used, while maybe not 100% pure true random, are very close and for the sake of what they are used for, mean that the resultant products (the slots) are totally random. Also, about the manipulation thing… not really. Nearly all this stuff is compiled code that actually doesn’t even run on the Casino’s systems (it runs at the game provider level) so it can’t be manipulated.

Everyone who makes a slot knows the percentages and odds. What you’re implying is that once it is given to a Casino, they change a bunch of stuff? No, not how it works. Again, Casino’s don’t actually take the slot logic on to their own systems. The slots run on the game providers systems and again, it is all pre-compiled packages that are hashsummed to ensure they are the accredited versions that were independently tested. Additionally, the same logic is often in use by multiple Casino’s at once, so for one Casino to start modifying outcomes would be extremely difficult.

So yeh, sorry, but your assertions are totally wrong. My company deployed hundreds of games to many Casino’s, and we knew exactly how they worked at all times, knew what versions were deployed and had 100% access to check at all times. The reality is, Casino’s simply don’t care that much. They just want good games. They don’t really like to get involved beyond that.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

argyl53 wrote:

@TheReelStory indeed Mersenne-Twister would actually produce “acceptably random” results as far as the Gambling Commission is concerned, the reason it would never be used for a slot is precisely because any exploitability would, as you say, be in the player’s favour. As far as producing statistically random results over a large sample size goes, MT is a very good algorithm.

Yeh, the company I used to work for had an RNG based on the Mersenne Twister. It was actually a collection of about 36 twisters in sequence, each seeding the next and producing random numbers one by one, reseeded by a slower cryptographically secure algorithm once each twister had produced about 300 numbers.

So we had the benefit of the speed of the twisters (pre-populating pools of random numbers for efficiency) but never letting them get to the point of predictability.

It passed accreditation so it was all good haha.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

Let me just add that I’m a mensa member with a measured and verified IQ of 180. Only 1 in 3.5 million people understand logics as well as I do, so unless you’re one of them, you’re not even gonna be able to follow the argument on the level I’m presenting it.

I see patterns in everything, and everyone still stand on their claims that their man made products are random. It makes no sense at all.

Ok, that’s fine. You understand randomness and patterns better than us. No problem. What you don’t understand is how or why randomness matters or is implemented in a slot game. You also don’t understand how slots are designed and operate.

You can be the rain man of randomness, but if you don’t truly understand what impact randomness is having on a particular implementation, then it really doesn’t matter how well you know that subject, because you lack all the rest of the crucial context.

The RNG is a tiny tiny component of a slot machine. And the Slot Machine is a tiny component in the machine that is a Casino and the Players. You need to understand all of it.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

I give up. If you want to claim you understand the meaning of random, while saying “random enough” is random, you’re a lost cause, and have no sense of logics at all.

You seem to misunderstand the impact that randomness plays. Even IF something isn’t truly random, that just means it is predictable. Predictability in gambling is in the PLAYERS favour, NOT the Casino.

So let’s do a couple of examples.

<span style=”text-decoration: underline;”>Example 1</span>

A predictable RNG algorithm is being used (such as the Mersenne Twister) which means, if I know 624 results, I can predict the RNG. How does this effect a slot? Well, I should be able to predict the result, but I have to know a few things.

a) I am the only one playing, so all the numbers I get are in sequence

b) That the numbers that are used by the slot are the actual RNG results, not transformed versions of the RNG result (I.E, taking a number and transforming it mathematically to a range of reel stops, say 0-100).

c) The reel sets of the slots in question so I know what stop positions are wins and what aren’t

d) Have a method of ‘skipping’ the bad results of the RNG (it would have to be someone else playing and losing money at this point) so I can take the good results.

Even if I had all this information, it would be in my favour. I’d be able to beat the Casino. If I don’t have all this information, I cannot predict the RNG, therefore, from my perspective, the outcome is still unknown and random.

<span style=”text-decoration: underline;”>Example 2</span>

Let’s say that, rather than using an RNG, a slot has a set of pre-programmed results in a sequence. So a Casino would know, spin by spin, what the result would be and when the sequence is exhausted, the RTP was 96% and the slot stops working.

To predict the result I need to know

a) The sequence

b) Where in the sequence I start playing

c) How many others are playing so I know how quickly the sequence is getting run through

If I know all those things, I can predict outcomes and beat the Casino. If I don’t know all those things, from my perspective the outcome is unknown and random.

(P.S, this would also be illegal)

<span style=”text-decoration: underline;”>Conclusion</span>

1. To the player, it doesn’t really matter how random the RNG is, as there are so many other factors in play.

2. A predictable RNG is in the players favour, not the Casino’s.

3. The maths is already against you. An RTP of <100% means you WILL lose eventually. You might win in the short term, but overall, you will lose.

The issue you are describing isn’t a lack of true randomness, it’s a lack of randomness AT ALL. I.E, the Casino watches your play and chooses when you win or lose. Sure, that’d be awful (and is illegal and also stupid and borderline impossible). This simply isn’t how it works.

Check my RTP video on YouTube, please. I literally write and walk through a very simple slot. It shows how they are built, work and how the RTP is determined and adjusted. You have some deeply ingrained ideas about this stuff but they are utterly misinformed and you’ve tied together several pieces of logic into a result that actually makes no sense because you don’t fully understand how the pieces truly interact with each other.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

If there was such a thing as true randomness, you could end up winning the jackpot/highest payout 10 spins in a row at max stake, and if that was possible, a casino could go bankrupt over 10 spins on a slot machine. True randomness is the only thing that is random. “Random enough” means it’s not really random, which means there are certain parameters set that prevents payouts to be too big.

Example: BTG says their slots can have a set max payout on any given spin/sequence, and it’s different from casino to casino. How do you take this into randomness? The answer is: You can’t.

Slot code HAS to be programmed so you can only get certain combinations x amount of times over x amount of spins. Without it, there is no way to guarantee a profitable slot, or even guarantee the RTP.

Again, you couldn’t be more wrong.

The randomness doesn’t matter. It is 100% possible for the highest payout to get hit 10 spins in a row. Totally possible. However, the odds are ASTRONIMICALLY tiny, so it’s not a real risk. Add to this that Casino’s put in Max Stake and Max Win limits for exactly this reason, to limit their exposure. Having an upper limit on something doesn’t mean it’s not random. Just means you cap the win.

For the BTG thing, yes, Casino’s can set a max win cap for games. This is pretty standard. So the slot might pay £1,000,000 but you’ll only actually win £5,000 (or whatever the cap is set at).

Slot code does NOT have to be set that way, at all. It’s all based on probability. If you build a slot with a mathematical model that produces an RTP of < 100%, then the slot is profitable. Maybe not profitable all the time. There might be days or months when it makes a loss (i’ve seen this many times) however, over its life, it will be profitable.

You are correct on one thing, the RTP is not a guarantee. Casino’s take a small bit of short term risk on any type of gambling (people can win big). However, in the long term, their risk is very, very small because the maths is always in their favour.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Just noticed my video links got removed. Sorry, they were informational videos (I wasn’t advertising the channel) but appreciate the rules.

So if you are interested to know more detail behind how slots are made, please have a look on my channel on YouTube called ‘The Reel Story’. I have a playlist there called ‘How Slots Work’ that contains 2 videos. One on the basics of slots and another explaining how RTP works.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

32red wrote:

Yeah that’s not how RTP works. There is no ‘pot’ where RTP is taken from. The figure is purely theoretical. Think of roulette where you get a 35/1 payout but the true payout is 36/1. Slots work on the same basis but just with millions more combinations and associated odds for hitting each every time you hit spin.

If you hit a jackpot then your odds of hitting it on the next spin again are exactly the same.

If Roshtein was getting 300% sticky bonuses on £2k deposits with no cap or max bet then doubt that is insanely profitable (and likely far too profitable for it to be offered). Running through a sim with £50 spins suggests an expected value of around £1700 profit.

No, there is actually no such thing as true randomness in code. It’s impossible to achieve true randomness in something man made. So no, dumbass, you’re not getting to walk away with this bullshit. I recommend people read this, so you get to understand that there is no such thing as true randomness in man made computer code.

Can a computer generate a truly random number?

<iframe class=”wp-embedded-content” style=”position: absolute; clip: rect(1px, 1px, 1px, 1px);” title=”“Can a computer generate a truly random number?” — MIT School of Engineering” src=”https://engineering.mit.edu/engage/ask-an-engineer/can-a-computer-generate-a-truly-random-number/embed/#?secret=j2zAwySIZq&#8221; width=”600″ height=”338″ frameborder=”0″ marginwidth=”0″ marginheight=”0″ scrolling=”no” sandbox=”allow-scripts” data-secret=”j2zAwySIZq”></iframe>
Check mate, morons

No, it can’t, but for the purposes of slots it is ‘random enough’. Typically using a hardware RNG to ‘seed’ the software RNG at intervals to ensure no pattern occurs.

Regardless of whether it is ‘truely’ random or ‘random enough’ makes no practical difference to the implementation of slots. It doesn’t make them ‘rigged’ or ‘set’. From every perspective, they are still acceptably fully random.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

awesomex wrote:

Mouse75 wrote:

awesomex wrote:

Hi,

First, let me introduce myself for those who don’t know me; I’m Asle Martinsen, a long time moderator for CasinoDaddy and CasinoGrounds. I have been a moderator on YouTube for 3 years now, and have had a close eye on the YouTube/Twitch gambling streamers. Through my years of experience I’ve become friends with a lot of streamers and regulars in the community, and I talk to many very frequently.

Now, let’s get on to Roshtein. Someone I moderate for (I don’t wanna reveal his name) has an employee who works on their behalf to set up affiliate deals with new casinos. This person has showed me screenshots from a conversation between him and Roshtein, as well as screenshots of conversations between the casinos Roshtein represent and himself (the employee). Here is one screenshot between a casino affiliate manager who contacted a representative for one of the streamers I moderate for:

Just the fact the casino affiliate manager was the one who made contact says a lot. They don’t go out looking for affiliates – affiliates contact the casinos. That’s the normal procedure.

Through conversations with reliable people, I have learned that Roshtein has operated with a deal where only 5% of the money he plays with is actually his, and he also has a max cashout of something like 5x the deposit amount. Meaning if it says Roshtein deposited €2000 with a 300% bonus (€8000 starting balance), he actually only deposited €100, and has a max cashout of €500. And that’s only with some casinos. With others he has another deal, where he plays exclusively with demo accounts. I know for a fact he’s got a very rigged deal specifically with N1 casino, where he puts absolutely no money down for any of his “deposits”.
The fucked up thing here is that when Roshtein hits tons of big wins, it takes a certain amount “out of the pot” (RTP), and since he keeps doing this over and over and over, without it being legitimate money, and he wins such huge amounts, these are potential wins taken out of the pot from other players. If he keeps playing €50 euro spins with the casino’s money and wins €100,000, that €100,000 is then out of the ~96% RTP “pot”. As you know, a certain “jackpot” hit combination, like 5 explorers on book of dead for example, is programmed to come only x amount of times per x amount of spins. Well, his hits takes tons of these out of the pot for regular players. RTP is of course calculated over like a few billion spins, but let’s look at how that actually works out: A huge majority of players spin at less than €1 stake. Most are probably at min stake, so let’s say 0.20 stake. €100,000 is the equivalent of 500,000 losing spins on 0.20 stake. Then imagine you do a €50 deposit at 0.20 stake, which is 250 times your stake. The math and logic is simple if you look at it this way.

There is a reason why nobody in the affiliate industry wants to be affiliated with Roshtein. Yes, he has a lot of viewers, but that’s cus he’s good at faking it.
If you go to youtube and look for the video where Slotspinner hits a 5 of a kind explorer on Book of Dead, notice his reaction and how he says “Is it ten-thousand?” – Then go look at Roshtein’s reaction at a later date, where he straight up copies Slotspinner’s reaction with a “Is it three-thousand?”. These two videos was like 3 months apart, with Roshtein’s being the later one.

It’s so blatantly obvious he’s just copying the best reactions from other streamers. And as he’s a good actor, he’s making a lot of naive people believe he’s legit.
Here’s another secret: When there are get-togethers for all the casino affiliates from all the various casinos, NOBODY wants to be seen with Roshtein, cus nobody likes him. The reason behind that is that he’s misrepresenting the industry, and shows people that carelessness pays off – just what someone scamming you wants you to think.
He also promoted casinos that gave a 400% deposit bonus, which is the model used by casinos who don’t have any of the regular providers, who nobody really knows about, and just come off as dodgy with a chat popup before you’ve even created an account, telling you about a “special offer” where you can deposit thousands and get 400% on top of that, which anyone can see is bullshit, as if a legit casino did this, it would be like handing out money for free. The casino industry does not hand out money for nothing, let me assure you of that.

I would love for eejit to come into this chat and make a comment about Roshtein as well, as everyone here knows eejit knows quite a lot about the industry. He can let you know what the casinos Roshtein works for are like.

I just had a look through the casinos Roshtein promotes, and here they are:
N1 Casino (mentioned above).
Ladyhammer (curacao casino, no MGA or UKGC license).

I can’t find more right now, but let’s talk about these two, and ask yourself these questions:
Have you ever seen these casinos before? Do any of the streamers you trust play there? Why do you think Roshtein is the only streamer to play at these casinos?

If you’re dumb enough to play at the casinos Roshtein promotes, don’t come crying on this forum when you don’t get your money due to some dodgy terms, or just a straight up bullshit casino.

Some really interesting points here – thank you,

Is there anyone else you can name and shame?

One point though – your comments on RTP are mistaken – if the games are truly random as advertised – the odds of winning are not changed by anyone hitting it big, every spin should have exactly the same likelihood of hitting big, in fact – you could have back to back jackpots as a random game can do anything. (A good thing really – otherwise no one would be able to touch Reel King as it a cash machine for the Bandit!)

CasinoRobot was another one who used to play with fake money. He was revealed to have a fake account cus he fucked up on stream, for everyone to see.

People can say what they want, but when it comes to computer code, there’s no such thing as randomness. There’s always a pre-programmed amount of winning combinations, and a set amount of times any X win will happen across X amount of spins. Just look at “The curious case of the Jammin Jars” – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zc53rrmxz34&t=483s
The explanation from the developers for this case is that there are 1.3 million different sequences on Jammin Jars etc.
Computer code and casinos never leave anything to chance – In the end it’s all controlled.

I’m not fussed about Roshtein, but I wanted to address your comments on the technology, because you’re completely wrong here 🙂

There is plenty of randomness in computer code if you want it to be there. Sure, code always does what you tell it,but if you feed a random number in to code, a random result will come out the other end.

Also, there is no ‘pot’ of results as such. Not in the way that when a result is won it is removed. In the case of Jammin Jars, they use a pool of possible results but, as your video proves, someone winning doesn’t mean someone else can’t. If there are 1.3 million different possible results, then every spin, you have a 1 in 1.3 million chance of hitting any one of them. So it is random. That pool of results will, of course, be weighted in such a way that there are more losing results than winning, but your chance of hitting any one of them is random.

With normal slots, there is no ‘pool’. The game is set up with reels, symbols, payouts etc and then the RNG returns 1 number for each reel (the stop position). Where the reels stop determines the result.

As for RTP, it is not something that is ‘set’ or ‘targeted’. It is determined by the math model of the slot. The way the reels, symbols, payout values etc are set generate an RTP. You simulate a slot (or do the maths) to determine what this number is. Designing a good slot means balancing a good RTP (96-98%) with fun play, and to do this, you have to do many tweaks and changes to the setup before you get it right.

 

*edited Seedy dont go advertising your channel directly in someone else forum most importantly you didnt even ask… If you want people to find your videos then by all means say what you youtube channel is called so people can go search it for themselves if they would like.*

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Masquerade wrote:

But can the overall RTP / model include in-built variance to exploit the player psychology or reduce potentially fatal spikes in the customer(s) (the casinos) losses ??

Can the maths include legitimate switches to the way that the game plays  ?? (e.g. through symbol changes on reels, increases/decreases in random feature chances) . As long as the game plays within its stated RTP then I can’t see why a developer wouldn’t want to make it more exciting for the player-base, but at the same time not wanting to see deviation in hundreds of Steves hitting the top of the ReelKing ladder in quick succession and denting the smaller casino customers. I know that, over time, the game will do what it says without modification but, games get replaced and you don’t want to lose a customer because the are currently down far too much to afford to take on your next game.

As you are testing these games though the billions of spins, are subtle changes being made by the server on the fly to iron out the bumps?? You’re not ‘compensating’ as the RTP has to stay the same – just shifting what percentage of that RTP comes from where.

Not ‘Rigged’ but ‘Dynamically Adapted’

As above, no, that isn’t what happens (it wouldn’t be legal). It would also be almost technically impossible to change the game mechanics while still hitting the same RTP. What you have to remember is that the RTP is not set, it is calculated. You set up the game, simulate it (or work out the maths) and get the RTP out. The RTP is not a target, it is just what will happen based on the setup of the game.

The art to designing slots is to get the game set up in such a way that the RTP is in the right range (95-98%) but still be compelling to play (bonuses hit reasonably often, variance is good, big wins are possible etc). To try and do that dynamically? Very VERY difficult.

Also as above, Casino’s protect their exposure by setting limits. Max stake, stake selections and even Max Win limits. Some games have a hard limit (5000x max win) whereas others can literally have an infinite max win (infinite retriggers on free spins for instance) so casino’s will put a top limit on the monetary win, such as 100k.

[TheReelStory WANTED $14 Outlaw]

Chdl1990 wrote:

Just to have my 2p worth. I don’t think it’s rigged but I would never say that with much certainty. However what I do believe is there are that many players playing at the same time to rig it would be pointless as someone has to win that’s the nature of it. I have in the past felt something wasn’t quite right but then sometimes that feeling goes in my favour, when your the smallest player at a blackjack table an you hit nothing but 21’s whilst the guy next to you betting big picks up all the 3’s and 4’s for you ? putting a slot on silly stake with nothing, soon as you put it down, bonus drops in, probably just coincidence, maybe more but fact is I can’t do anything except enjoy the fact I have a bonus and hope it pays the world!!

Feelings (and in fact, Psychology) are a massive part of gambling (on both sides). Casino’s and slot operators use psychology to get you to play more (teases in slots, different volatility maths models etc) and it is also the reason that gamblers do the things they do (chase losses cause the next big win MUST be close IE gamblers fallacy, thinking you’re winning when actually you’ve lost overall etc).

The human brain is wired to remember specific events and emotions. So if you hit a big winning streak, you’ll remember it, if you hit a big losing streak, you’ll remember it. If you tie suspicions to an event (like withdrawing and then playing after and losing) you will remember it and it will skew your memory and your thinking.

If you saw the actual statistics of those events occurring, you’d probably be surprised about how they don’t match your memory, but that’s the way it is. Also, statistics play a big part. Things aren’t really statistically significant until you hit the millions of occurrences. So with the withdrawal -> not winning example, the chances are you’ve only experienced that event a few hundred times (maybe not even that) so it’s very possible that your experience is just unlucky compared with the average, but still well within realistic statistical boundaries.

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